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GCU & Seattle U to WCC

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GCU & Seattle U to WCC Empty GCU & Seattle U to WCC

Post by UP24 Fri May 10, 2024 10:45 am

GCU and Seattle U heading to the WCC in 2025! How do we feel about this? How will it affect Portland?
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Post by up7587 Fri May 10, 2024 11:56 am

UP24 wrote:GCU and Seattle U heading to the WCC in 2025! How do we feel about this? How will it affect Portland?

Effective July 1, 2025.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/wcc-to-add-grand-canyon-seattle-u-to-get-to-13-teams-in-2025-26-but-after-that-it-gets-complicated/

CBS Sports wrote:Seattle U is a geographic and religious fit — it is a Jesuit university like every other WCC school.

Umm, St. Mary's, San Diego, and Portland would like to have a word.

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Post by UP24 Fri May 10, 2024 12:49 pm

Looks like they edited it haha

“ Seattle U is a geographic fit, in addition to being a religious one; it is a Jesuit university, like many other WCC schools”
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Post by DoubleDipper Fri May 10, 2024 12:59 pm

UP24 wrote:“ Seattle U is a geographic fit, in addition to being a religious one; it is a Jesuit university, like many other WCC schools”
"Many," but not most:

NOT Jesuit:
1. Portland
2. St. Mary's
3. San Diego
4. Pepperdine
5. Pacific
6. Washington State
7. Oregon State
(8. Grand Canyon)


Last edited by DoubleDipper on Fri May 10, 2024 6:32 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Accuracy)
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Post by wrv Fri May 10, 2024 3:19 pm

Curious course of events if when the WCC allowed OSU and WSU to affiliate, however briefly, it/they were aware of the permanent candidates for expansion, Seattle and GCU, who will join a little more than a year from now.

NIL money?  More germane, how much money did the conference receive for allowing two years of affiliation with OSU and WSU?  They are not the fit Jesuit Seattle is, for instance.
What happens when the two years of affiliation are up?
Do OSU and WSU possibly stay affiliated? Do they join the Mountain West? If so, it doesn't make sense to have affiliated with the WCC in the first place. The Big 12?
Perhaps OSU and WSU needed two years to become members of the Big 12?
The times they are ah changing. . .
The conference is arguably stronger with Seattle and GCU. Good move.

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Post by UPSoccerFanatic Fri May 10, 2024 4:24 pm

From a women's soccer perspective, this looks good to me. Seattle typically has been reasonably strong, not world beaters but respectable. Grand Canyon has come on strong since hiring its current coach in 2020 and likely will be in the ball park of the upper half of the conference.

My understanding is that Grand Canyon really wanted in.
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Post by Geezaldinho Fri May 10, 2024 5:12 pm

up7587 wrote:
UP24 wrote:GCU and Seattle U heading to the WCC in 2025! How do we feel about this? How will it affect Portland?

Effective July 1, 2025.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/wcc-to-add-grand-canyon-seattle-u-to-get-to-13-teams-in-2025-26-but-after-that-it-gets-complicated/

CBS Sports wrote:Seattle U is a geographic and religious fit — it is a Jesuit university like every other WCC school.

Umm, St. Mary's, San Diego, and Portland would like to have a word.

…and Pepperdine.
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Post by up7587 Fri May 10, 2024 5:29 pm

Geezaldinho wrote:…and Pepperdine.

...and Pacific. My original list was just the Catholic WCC schools that are not Jesuit. But the Jesuit schools are currently only 4/9ths of the conference.

Since the original article was so wrong about the nature of the conference members, I wonder what else is wrong in the article that we don't know about.

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Post by up7587 Fri May 10, 2024 5:43 pm

Both SU and GCU are leaving the WAC conference. SU was a long distance from all the other WAC members, so they are likely delighted to join the WCC.

New Mexico St. and Sam Houston St. left the WAC last year. If the WAC falls apart, the WCC should pick up Cal Baptist, the only California school in the WAC. The other WAC members are all in Utah and Texas.

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Post by Geezaldinho Fri May 10, 2024 5:48 pm

up7587 wrote:
Geezaldinho wrote:…and Pepperdine.

...and Pacific.  My original list was just the Catholic WCC schools that are not Jesuit.  But the Jesuit schools are currently only 4/9ths of the conference.  

Since the original article was so wrong about the nature of the conference members, I wonder what else is wrong in the article that we don't know about.

One possible conference strategy is that Stu Jackson is preparing the conference for the possibility that the zags leave the conference. The yearly threat of them going elsewhere and wanting special treatment to stay appears to be wearing a bit thin.
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Post by DoubleDipper Fri May 10, 2024 6:47 pm

UP24 wrote:How will it affect Portland?
Grand Canyon and Seattle will compete in 14 of the WCC's 16 sponsored sports. Both institutions sponsor men's basketball, women's basketball, baseball, softball, men's soccer, women's soccer, volleyball, men's tennis, women's tennis, men's golf, women's golf, men's cross country and women's cross country; while Grand Canyon will compete in beach volleyball and Seattle will compete in rowing.

I believe Portland will be competitive with both schools in all sports except perhaps, Men's Basketball where GCU has excelled in recent years and continues to draw some of the top transfers and high school grads to their facilities, warm winter weather, and large crowds.

UP will not field a softball team, and I do not see UP getting back into golf in the near term, but when the $$$ to support  GCU & Seattle U to WCC 26f3  finally arrives, I think golf will make a return.

Lacrosse, anyone?
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Post by Geezaldinho Fri May 10, 2024 10:14 pm

DoubleDipper wrote:

Lacrosse, anyone?

Not likely. In Men’s lacrosse there are maybe a dozen D1 schools like USC, Arizona, Denver and the USAF Academy. I can’ only think of a couple  other California schools that play the sport and I’m not sure it’s at the D1 level.. Now if we played Canadian schools, we would travel less.

For the women it gets a little better. Oregon has a team, and there are about 4-6 Cal  State schools and maybe 4 Pac12 programs. ( remember the PAC12?) Maybe a couple more.

But there would be lots of travel, and I’m not sure the University is willing to take on a travel intensive schedule at this time.
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Post by DoubleDipper Sat May 11, 2024 2:38 pm

UP24 wrote:GCU and Seattle U heading to the WCC in 2025! How do we feel about this?
From an athletics/financial standpoint, it's probably a good move for the WCC and GCU and certainly for Seattle, but I am not a fan of GCU the institution and do not like that they are now part of the WCC as an institution that uses deceptive practices to further its profit making.

Recently seeing "click bait" headlines such as "Biden Admin Hits GCU, Nation's Largest Christian University, with Unprecedented Fine," are actually true....

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/biden-admin-hits-gcu-nations-largest-christian-university-with-unprecedented-fine/ar-AA1jb2aG

Under Betsy Devos, U.S. Secretary of Education for the Trump administration, the department has sought to repeal some rules enacted during President Barack Obama's administration...and the story of GCU's finances is a really murky one...

https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-education/2019/11/13/grand-canyon-university-denied-non-profit-status-due-financial-deal/4177203002/
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Post by DoubleDipper Sat May 11, 2024 2:56 pm

Despite the nonprofit status that GCU apparently enjoys, the school through its parent, Grand Canyon Education, Inc., still operates with a business-oriented approach, focusing on growth and financial sustainability and you can buy its stock on the NASDAQ.

Probably nothing to do with the WCC, but LOPE's stock dropped a little yesterday... Suspect

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Post by up7587 Sat May 11, 2024 3:33 pm

DoubleDipper wrote:Despite the nonprofit status that GCU apparently enjoys, the school through its parent, Grand Canyon Education, Inc., still operates with a business-oriented approach, focusing on growth and financial sustainability . . .

I know nothing about GCU's finances, but growth and financial sustainability are not bad things for anyone.

CNBC.com wrote:Since 2016, 91 U.S. private colleges have closed, merged with another school, or announced plans to close, according to a CNBC analysis of data from Higher Ed Dive. Almost half of those schools closed after the onset of the Covid pandemic in 2020. For many struggling schools the pandemic was the final straw — but two major themes showed up consistently throughout the closures: finances and enrollment.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/06/17/why-more-and-more-colleges-are-closing-down-across-the-us.html

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Post by Snus Junction Sat May 11, 2024 4:34 pm

I had been hoping Seattle University would join the conference and Grand Canyon is a good addition to, maybe from the basketball perspective even better. The finances of the two schools is to me irrelevant. I want to see some good “hooping” And I think this will serve to attract more good players to the University of Portland.

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Post by ExpatPilot Sun May 12, 2024 4:21 pm

For what it's worth: my own two cents...

I do not like affiliating with GCU at all as this helps to normalize their model of education which could be best described as an overpriced diploma mill which operates primarily using adjunct academic labor. Despite the abundance of small college closings and the looming enrollment cliff, I am not comfortable with enabling this as an alternative financial model. It's unfair to students and unfair to staff.

That said, I am certain they will be an athletically-competitive member of the conference. TOTAL SPECULATION on my part here (isn't that what this forum is about?): I wonder if their for-profit GCU Education owner is able to leverage NIL to their own advantage?

Really, we should be upset there is another purple school!

Seattle: welcome!

To the point on adding future sports: of course, most D2 and D3 universities use sport as recruitment to get students to enroll at universities they would otherwise not attend in the first place else many of them would be unremarkable and close. Given the enrollment cliff (and the enrollment drop at UP this last fall, I think?), I worry that smaller D1s like UP will need to do the same? So, you add large roster sports in hopes that many of those students will pay SOME of the tuition. Given our facilities, the greater Portland area, as well as nearby competition, women's lacrosse would make sense as would softball. Dare I suggest men's volleyball would be an easy add? Golf would not accomplish that for us.

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