The Preseason WCC & Non-Conference Opponent Thread, Part 1

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The Preseason WCC & Non-Conference Opponent Thread, Part 1 Empty The Preseason WCC & Non-Conference Opponent Thread, Part 1

Post by DoubleDipper on Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:15 pm

Three games worth scouting on Tuesday that I'll be setting my DVR to record are:

1. 6pm, Idaho State at Gonzaga on ROOT. Can former Pilot Chier Maker help his Bengal team this year?  How about the two new transfer Zags, Crandall and Clarke, are they the two additions who can help GU go deep into the Tournament?

2. 8pm, BYU at Nevada on CBSSD. Did former Pilot Jazz Johnson give up his starting role at UP for the bench at Nevada…or will he be able to hold a starting spot? BYU’s Nick Emery is suspended for the first 9 games for his “Significant Breach of Conduct,” so that bit of entertainment will be missing, but how about Yoeli Childs, will he be the WCC POY?

3. 8pm, PSU at UO on the Pac12 Network.  PSU was crazy-good the first half of last season until Deonte North was asked to leave the team…are they even better this year?  Can the Pilots ruin "Greenout Night" at the Viking Pavilion on Dec 5?
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Post by Sound Voltex on Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:32 pm

Opening day in the WCC - everyone who had games today won except BYU.

Pacific 74, SIU-Edwardsville 65
Loyola Marymount 75, Westcliff 43
#3 Gonzaga 120, Idaho State 79
San Francisco 76, UC Davis 42
San Diego 83, Weber State 66
#7 Nevada 86, BYU 70
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Post by up7587 on Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:30 pm

DoubleDipper wrote:How about the two new transfer Zags, Crandall and Clarke, are they the two additions who can help GU go deep into the Tournament?
Clarke started, scored 15 points with 9 rebounds. Crandall had 9 points and 6 assists.
Hachimura had 33 points, Norvell had 23 points.

DoubleDipper wrote:PSU was crazy-good the first half of last season until Deonte North was asked to leave the team…are they even better this year?
Oregon rolled 84-57.
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Post by DoubleDipper on Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:01 pm

DoubleDipper wrote:1. 6pm, Idaho State at Gonzaga on ROOT. Can former Pilot Chier Maker help his Bengal team this year?  
I was very impressed with Chier's physical maturity and playing ability since we last saw him.  He was second in scoring, 13, and led the team in rebounds, 7, and minutes played, 33.  Turns out it may have been the correct decision to go to a JUCO for a year instead of D2 as some suggested he do.
DoubleDipper wrote:2. 8pm, BYU at Nevada on CBSSD. Did former Pilot Jazz Johnson give up his starting role at UP for the bench at Nevada…or will he be able to hold a starting spot? BYU’s Nick Emery is suspended for the first 9 games for his “Significant Breach of Conduct,” so that bit of entertainment will be missing, but how about Yoeli Childs, will he be the WCC POY?
With the Pilots Jazz shot the 3 and also drove the basket to either score or dish, but last night he was an outsides shooter only.  Based upon his playing time, the loud and enthusiastic fans, the facilities, and the team's #7 national ranking....Jazz made the right decision leaving UP, even if he's not a starter this year.  

Yoeli is a very good ball player, but he picked up 3 quick fouls last evening, and a fourth at the beginning of the second half before fouling out.  BYU stayed with Nevada most of the game, but with Yoeli in foul trouble the Wolf Pack ran away at the end.  Nevada is good, but they looked over ranked against BYU.
DoubleDipper wrote:3. 8pm, PSU at UO on the Pac12 Network.  PSU was crazy-good the first half of last season until Deonte North was asked to leave the team…are they even better this year?  Can the Pilots ruin "Greenout Night" at the Viking Pavilion on Dec 5?
If UP and PSU were to play tomorrow, PSU would win!  They're stronger, quicker, and more mature, but the Pilots have four weeks to try and catch up....
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Post by DoubleDipper on Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:11 pm

Sound Voltex wrote:San Francisco 76, UC Davis 42
I watched tape of this game...USF looked like a well oiled machine and in mid-season form while playing their entire bench in their steamrolling of the Aggies.

Former Pilot Colin Russel played 8 minutes, contributing a foul and a turnover for UC Davis.

(After USF's back-to-back 20 win seasons for the first time in 36 years, Coach Smith signed a multi-year contract extension before the start of the preseason).
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Post by Sound Voltex on Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:07 pm

WCC opening week day dos - Pepperdine and Saint Mary's make their season debut.

Pepperdine 100, CSU Dominguez Hills 66
Saint Mary's 87, McNeese 65

Santa Clara makes their season debut Friday against Prairie View A&M.
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Post by up7587 on Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:33 pm

DoubleDipper wrote:If UP and PSU were to play tomorrow, PSU would win!  They're stronger, quicker, and more mature, but the Pilots have four weeks to try and catch up....

PSU shot 5-35 from 3P (14%). Was that awesome Duck defense, or a really off night? If they are really that bad, that's a lot of shots to throw up.
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Post by DoubleDipper on Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:55 pm

up7587 wrote:PSU shot 5-35 from 3P (14%).  Was that awesome Duck defense, or a really off night?  If they are really that bad, that's a lot of shots to throw up.  
Both!

PSU's intensity and ball hawking would go a long way in a matchup with the Pilots in their current maturing stage, but UO's extreme height advantage was just too much for PSU to overcome and they had to resort to shooting from outside their comfort range even though they had some good looks.

I think PSU led the rebounding and steals category just because of their intense hustle, but their shooting was just the opposite of what we saw from Multnomah in the Chiles Center....ice cold instead of red hot!

The Vikings look wild and crazy again this season, and they will certainly disrupt opposing teams, but they couldn't take advantage of that disruption against UO simply because their shots just wouldn't drop.

We know former Central Catholic star Deante Strickland is a good shooter...last night he made just one bucket.
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Post by Sound Voltex on Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:43 pm

Final scores from the rest of the WCC tonight:

BYU 75, Utah Valley 65
#7 Nevada 83, Pacific 61
Prairie View A&M 81, Santa Clara 64
San Diego 76, UC Davis 57
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Post by Sound Voltex on Sun Nov 11, 2018 6:56 pm

Rest of the WCC yesterday and today:

San Francisco 93, Maine 50
#3 Gonzaga 104, Texas Southern 67
CSU Northridge at Pepperdine - Postponed
Loyola Marymount 61, UNLV 50
Saint Mary's 92, Utah Valley 63
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Post by NoPoNeighbor on Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:45 am

That's a good road win for LMU, at UNLV.
The Pilots' almost won at UNLV a few years ago. I remember us snatching defeat from the jaws of victory and Cody Doolin (previously of USF) hit a buzzer-beater for the win.
Also there was a Riley Barker breakaway dunk.

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Post by Sound Voltex on Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:04 pm

Around the WCC tonight:
San Francisco 88, Sonoma State 54
Washington 66, San Diego 63
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Post by Dean Murdoch on Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:24 am

San Diego gave the Huskies a good scare in their barn. Had a chance to tie it at the buzzer.

WCC as a whole could be up, but I think you'll find out a lot in the coming days. SMC at New Mexico State tomorrow, Texas A&M at Gonzaga on Thursday, and Friday has Arizona State at USF and LMU/Georgetown on a neutral court in Jamaica. First chances for the conference to really prove it's a step up this year on the A10.
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Post by Dean Murdoch on Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:53 pm

Too much time designing the ad, not enough advance scouting of Prairie View A&M.
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Post by Sound Voltex on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:06 pm

Around the WCC tonight:
BYU 82, Northwestern State 57
Northern Colorado 88, Pepperdine 80
Loyola Marymount 79, CSU Northridge 64
Pacific 91, Stanislaus State 66
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Post by NoPoNeighbor on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:44 pm

LMU wins at Northridge by 15. We'll see how the Pilots stack up on Saturday.

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Post by NoPoNeighbor on Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:21 pm

Half of the WCC is currently in KenPom's top 100 (+2):
GU 7
BYU 57
SMC 60
USF 98
USD 102

Pilots bringing up the rear at 235.

Average KenPom ranking of the top 5 teams in a few non-P6 conferences:

American  59.2
WCC  64.8
Mountain West  85.8
A10  94
CUSA  105
Mid-American  105.4
Missouri Valley  105.4
Big Sky  166.6
Big West  167.2

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Post by Dean Murdoch on Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:17 am

I certainly did not realize just how much of a force Jordan Ford has become for SMC. He couldn't get any shots to fall from outside but still had 28 points and five assists in the Gaels' road win over New Mexico State last night.

That's the first win of national significance for the WCC this year if you are looking at the quadrant system. You can probably chalk that up as a Q2 win for the Gaels depending on how all this NET stuff shakes out.
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Post by DoubleDipper on Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:18 am

Dean Murdoch wrote:That's the first win of national significance for the WCC this year if you are looking at the quadrant system. You can probably chalk that up as a Q2 win for the Gaels depending on how all this NET stuff shakes out.
Man, I've got to get someone to explain the quadrant and NET to me.  Just being around high school and college students has kept me almost up-to-date on handshakes and the unwritten language, but the NCAA has kicked me back to the Stone Age in other areas.... Embarassed

Watched UP opponent Seattle U. hold off WSU, 78-69, last evening after leading by 15 points early.  The Redhawks are a three guard oriented team with a rangy Seton Hall transfer in the middle on defense....it should be a fun game on December 17, but UP has to get their starters back and stay healthy!!

What quadrant does tonight's Texas A&M @ GU fall in/under? The Aggies from Texas are higher rated than the Aggies from New Mexico that SMC beat. I'm sure it makes a difference in the NET that SMC won on the road, but does GU playing at home have any effect on the quadrant system? study scratch
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Post by Dean Murdoch on Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:40 am

Quadrant 1: Home 1-30; Neutral 1-50; Away 1-75
Quadrant 2: Home 31-75; Neutral 51-100; Away 76-135
Quadrant 3: Home 76-160; Neutral 101-200; Away 136-240
Quadrant 4: Home 161-plus; Neutral 201-plus; Away 241-plus.

Very generally, the NCAA considers Q1 wins (great), Q2 wins (good), Q3 losses (bad), and Q4 losses (awful) when it comes to seeding the tournament and picking at-large teams.

Last year they made all this noise about moving away from the RPI system to the quadrant system, but they still based the quadrants on a team's ranking in the RPI! This year they're using the NET instead of the RPI, which is purported to be more of a "Kenpom" style system which takes into account offensive/defensive metrics, margin of victory, and such.

New Mexico State is currently 107 in the Kenpoms so I figure they'll be something similar in the NET which would make the away win over them for SMC a Q2 win (though if they do well enough it could change to a Q1 win, and if they fall off enough it could become an irrelevant Q3 win).

Texas A&M is in the 60s right now, so a home win by Gonzaga tonight is looking like it could be a Q2 win for them.

I quite like this system because it is rewarding teams for playing away from home. I think you're already seeing the benefits of that for smaller schools - why else would Arizona State bother to visit USF, like they'll do on Friday? It's a win-win for both teams...an opportunity for USF to get a high major in their barn, and an opportunity for ASU to notch a Q2 win that will make their resume look better if they end up being a bubble team on Selection Sunday.
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Post by DoubleDipper on Thu Nov 15, 2018 11:07 am

Thanks for the rundown, Deaner…

Is the NET kept secret from the public?  Some are still displaying a daily RPI, but apparently no one is doing the same with NET, yet.

You consider KenPom to be closer to NET than the old, but still available, RPI?

As you alluded, the NET, like the RPI, will change during the season as teams/opponents win and lose.  I noted that KenPom rated NM St. #93 before they were beaten by SMC in Las Cruces, and now they are #107.
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Post by DoubleDipper on Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:00 pm

After glancing at the RPI it seems fairly obvious it is meaningless this early in the season....it would be nice to know what the NET is.

RPI:
11-GU
34-LMU
75-SMC
111-UOP
126-BYU
209-USD
252-UP
263-USF
334-SCU
347-PU

KenPom:
6-GU
46-SMC
59-BYU
97-USF
100-USD
124-LMU
149-UOP
224-PU
230-SCU
234-UP
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Post by Dean Murdoch on Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:09 pm

DoubleDipper wrote:Is the NET kept secret from the public?  Some are still displaying a daily RPI, but apparently no one is doing the same with NET, yet.

I don't think it'll be kept secret - I think it just hasn't been published yet. Jerry Palm tweeted a couple days ago that he expected them to come out in a couple of weeks or so, so maybe by the end of November?

DoubleDipper wrote:You consider KenPom to be closer to NET than the old, but still available, RPI?

I would certainly hope so!
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Post by Sound Voltex on Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:53 pm

Around the WCC tonight:
BYU 85, Oral Roberts 65
Pacific 83, Idaho State 76
UC Irvine 61, Santa Clara 49
San Diego 95, San Diego Christian 47
#3 Gonzaga 94, Texas A&M 71
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