St. Mary's Punished

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St. Mary's Punished

Post by up7587 on Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:05 am

Just saw this from the AP:
The NCAA has placed Saint Mary’s on four years’ probation for “failure to monitor its men’s basketball program,” reducing scholarships after it says the perennial mid-major power committed several recruiting violations.

The NCAA Committee on Infractions also said Friday that Gaels coach Randy Bennett “acted unethically in his recruitment of international prospects” and “failed to promote an atmosphere for compliance.” Bennett will not be allowed to recruit off campus and will serve a five-game suspension next season.

Saint Mary’s will still be allowed to participate in its conference tournament and the NCAA tournament, but can’t play in preseason or in-season tournaments. The program also will have a reduction in scholarships from 13 to 11 for the 2014-15 and 2015-16 seasons.
As much as we want to see better basketball at UP, I'd rather have what we've got than behavior like this.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Geezaldinho on Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:06 am

My first thought is

I wonder where Randy will move to?

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Geezaldinho on Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:19 am

Here are the full penalties:
Penalties in this case include:

Public reprimand and censure.
Four years probation from March 1, 2013 through February 28, 2017.

The head coach must serve a five-game suspension during the 2013-14 season.

The head coach may not recruit off-campus during the 2013-14 academic year.

A two-year show-cause order for the former assistant coach. The public report contains further details. 

Reduction of men’s basketball scholarships from 13 to 11 for the 2014-15 and 2015-16 seasons.

Elimination of foreign tours by the men’s basketball team until the start of the 2017-18 season.

The men’s basketball team may not participate in a multiple-team event until the 2015-16 season.

The men’s basketball team may not receive skill instruction during the 2013-14 and 2014-15 seasons.

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public/ncaa/resources/latest+news/2013/march/saint+marys+california+failed+to+monitor+its+mens+basketball+program

In addition, the assistant in question has a two year Show Cause order placed on him.


(it strikes me the censure is not very public, since no one is named)

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by PilotNut on Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:22 am

SF Chronicle Article

NCAA.com article

The schollie reductions are big... not to mention that Coach Bennett can not recruit off campus next year. Foreign tours are a big recruiting tool, so that will hurt (assuming they were somewhere in the cycle to allow one). Depending on the schedule, not coaching (at all--no travel, practice, etc) for the first 5 WCC games next year could be significant.

Does anyone know what the "The men’s basketball team may not receive skill instruction during the 2013-14 and 2014-15 seasons" means?

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Guest on Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:37 am

PilotNut wrote:Does anyone know what the "The men’s basketball team may not receive skill instruction during the 2013-14 and 2014-15 seasons" means?

(see below)


Last edited by DeanMurdoch on Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:45 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Guest on Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:44 am

PilotNut wrote:Does anyone know what the "The men’s basketball team may not receive skill instruction during the 2013-14 and 2014-15 seasons" means?

The full description of that penalty - "During the 2013-14 and 2014-15 academic years, no skill instruction for the men's basketball team, as defined in Bylaw 17.1.6.2.2, will be allowed."

The bylaw in question -

17.1.6.2.2 Skill Instruction—Sports Other Than Baseball and Football. Participation by student-athletes in skill-related instruction in sports other than baseball and football is permitted outside the institution’s declared playing season, from the institution’s first day of classes of the academic year or September 15, whichever occurs earlier, to one week prior to the beginning of the institution’s final examination period at the conclusion of the academic year. More than four student-athletes from the team may be involved in skill-related instruction with their coaches from September 15 through April 15. Prior to September 15 and after April 15, not more than four student-athletes from the same team may be involved in skill-related instruction with their coaches at any one time in any facility. Skill-related instruction shall not be publicized and shall not be conducted in view of a general public audience.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by PilotNut on Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:43 am

Thanks, Dean... this seems like it would be a notable deterrent for recruits.

SMC loses a lot of players the next 2 years (a quick count shows 10 Juniors & Seniors on their roster this year)... it will be interesting to see how this plays out.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by up7587 on Fri Mar 01, 2013 1:41 pm

Most importantly, how does this impact GU? Rolling Eyes

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by DoubleDipper on Fri Mar 01, 2013 5:49 pm

up7587 wrote:Most importantly, how does this impact GU? Rolling Eyes
Um, I don't get your drift.....

Personally, I've always been a bit dubious about SMC and USF....but never GU....seriously. Neutral

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by up7587 on Fri Mar 01, 2013 5:55 pm

Haha, I picked that up from a couple comments on the GU Boards, that a weaker SMC was bad for GU.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Geezaldinho on Fri Mar 01, 2013 6:36 pm

DoubleDipper wrote:
up7587 wrote:Most importantly, how does this impact GU? Rolling Eyes
Um, I don't get your drift.....

Personally, I've always been a bit dubious about SMC and USF....but never GU....seriously. Neutral

Really? You werent paying attention in the Fitzgerald era?

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=4841748

Fitzgerald stepped down in December 1997 after a school investigation determined he had been collecting and spending some athletic department funds without the knowledge of the university controller's office, a possible violation of NCAA rules. Fitzgerald contended that none of the money went to players or into his own pocket.


Monson and Few are his protoges, and Monson wasn't unscathed himself.
Fitz " stepped down " . And there is more to the story than was published. Randy hasn't had to.

And while the Few era hasn't been hit with any violations, they have been guilty of stupidity.
http://blog.seattlepi.com/seattlesports/2011/07/20/report-no-ncaa-probe-into-fraud-that-entangled-gonzaga-coaches/

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by DoubleDipper on Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:07 pm

PurpleGeezer wrote:
DoubleDipper wrote:
up7587 wrote:Most importantly, how does this impact GU? Rolling Eyes
Um, I don't get your drift.....

Personally, I've always been a bit dubious about SMC and USF....but never GU....seriously. Neutral

Really? You werent paying attention in the Fitzgerald era?
Yup, well aware Dan's troubles, and I've alluded to them on couple of occasions here on PN. Dan was a personal acquaintance of mine until his death three years ago.

Talking with Dan, there was always that hint of nostalgia for the "good old days" of recruiting. Any tricks Dan may have had were mostly just counter-tricks to other recruiting coaches around the country.....I'm not going to say "especially at Catholic schools," but those were the schools he spoke of most.....and there were some really great stories to be told!!

UP was not immune; just talk to the gentleman in the 5th row behind the scorer's table
.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by DoubleDipper on Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:35 pm

As soon as I learned of the sanctions against SMC here on PilotNation, I assumed it included the Aussie connection and former assistant David Patrick, because of Patrick’s less than clear recruiting practices when dealing with many Australian prospects.

However, at this morning’s press conference in Moraga, St. Mary’s officials dispelled my assumptions and those of others during the investigation:

1. The major infractions did not involve the recruitment of Australian players.
2. The violations were not perpetrated by former assistant coach David Patrick.

So, if it wasn’t Patrick and the Aussies, who?

St. Mary’s athletic director Mark Orr said the major infractions cited by the NCAA involved “impermissible benefits to a prospective student-athletes, including housing and workout gear.” He also said the prospective recruits involved in the major infractions were from France.

“None of the students were Australian,” said Orr.

Although St. Mary’s officials would not give out the name of the former assistant coach who violated NCAA rules, they did say the man had resigned after one year with program, back in August of 2009.

Well, it didn’t take too much checking of the St. Mary’s archives to discover former assistant Keith Moss resigned from St. Mary’s in August of 2009, after one year on the job.

French players and Keith Moss? There might even be more to the Randy Bennett chapter at St. Mary’s once they start looking into the Australian connection and former assistant David Patrick….for everyone’s sake, let’s hope not. Evil or Very Mad

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Guest on Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:31 pm

The violations were apparently connected to the recruitment of Remi Barry, who landed at New Mexico State.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by DoubleDipper on Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:13 pm

DeanMurdoch wrote:The violations were apparently connected to the recruitment of Remi Barry, who landed at New Mexico State.
Yea, I'd heard that, but then we learn there may have been as many as three recruits involved, none of whom ever attended SMC.

BUT, there were other violations as well. From ESPN (edited):
The NCAA also said Saint Mary's received "impermissible training and coaching sessions from trainers not employed by the school."

While Saint Mary's rise has been predicated largely on its Australian pipeline, Orr said the major violations handed down by the NCAA involved the recruitment of French players by the former assistant. None of those players ever attended the university, Orr said, though some secondary violations included Australian players who did.

The potential violations were brought to the attention of the NCAA in March 2011, when the assistant "helped place" a player in a high school, where he was deemed ineligible because of the assistance, according to the report. The university said it has fully cooperated with the NCAA since that time and already has made improvements in its athletic department, including hiring another compliance officer and beefing up background checks on prospective coaches.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Guest on Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:00 am

[quote="DoubleDipper"]BUT, there were other violations as well. From ESPN (edited):
The NCAA also said Saint Mary's received "impermissible training and coaching sessions from trainers not employed by the school."

While Saint Mary's rise has been predicated largely on its Australian pipeline, Orr said the major violations handed down by the NCAA involved the recruitment of French players by the former assistant. None of those players ever attended the university, Orr said, though some secondary violations included Australian players who did.

This I did not catch, thanks.

Pretty typical backlash from all this...SMC fans saying it's too harsh, some saying it's not harsh enough, most random ESPN commenters still mad about the Cam Newton fiasco. Some things are easy to predict.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by DoubleDipper on Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:18 pm

St. Mary’s top assistant Rick Croy has been named head coach at Cal Baptist….he a had a very good 3 year run at SMC, but obviously didn’t see a chance to move up there regardless of the sanctions.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Guest on Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:45 pm

Significant penalties to SMC, Craig "Noodles" Neal hired at New Mexico, now a SMC staff member bolts to Cal Baptist.

You've got to think that everything is pointing towards Cullen Neal decommitting from the Gaels and playing for UNM. Must be an awkward situation for Bennett.

Dellavedova and their starting PF Mitch Young gone this year and next year they lose the services of contributors Levesque, Holt, Page, Walker, Hodgson...if Cullen Neal does indeed jump ship, there's going to be a ton of holes on that Saint Mary's roster. And two less scholarships to fill them.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Geezaldinho on Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:56 pm

Fewer.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Guest on Mon Apr 08, 2013 1:04 pm

PurpleGeezer wrote:Fewer.



?

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by Geezaldinho on Mon Apr 08, 2013 1:22 pm

That's right.

NOT

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by OldePilot on Mon Apr 08, 2013 2:37 pm

I wonder if Calvin Hermanson from West Linn has had any second thoughts?

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by up7587 on Mon Apr 08, 2013 2:45 pm


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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by OldePilot on Mon Apr 08, 2013 2:55 pm

My bad.

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Re: St. Mary's Punished

Post by up7587 on Mon Apr 08, 2013 4:39 pm

OldePilot wrote:My bad.
Not weighing in on you, at all, OldePilot. Just commenting on the back and forth between Grant Fuhr and Les Schwab above you. Carry on.

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