Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

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Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by PilotNut on Sat May 22, 2010 4:27 pm

NCAA considering combining both gender's College Cups into the same weekend.

Put my vote in the "no" column for this.

NCAA Link

Soccer panels suggest combined College Cups for 2012

May 20, 2010 8:27:51 AM

By Gary Brown
The NCAA News

The Division I Men’s and Women’s Soccer Committees are recommending a joint men’s and women’s College Cup beginning in 2012.


The proposal heading to the Division I Championships/Sports Management Cabinet in September would stage both the men’s and women’s finals at the same site on the second weekend in December, the date formula currently in place for the men’s final (the women’s currently is a week earlier).

Under the proposed format, the women’s semifinals would be played on Thursday, followed by the men’s semis on Friday and both finals on Sunday.

The committees were considering the proposal for the 2011 College Cups but delayed the effective date to give women’s teams in particular more time to make scheduling arrangements (since their playing season would be impacted) and time for Division I to change playing-and-practice-season legislation that would accommodate a later start date for women’s soccer.

While the idea of a combined championship is not new for college soccer (Divisions II and III already do this), momentum for the change in Division I has been building as attendance and television ratings wane. Crowds for the men’s final have exceeded 10,000 only once since the championship’s heyday in Charlotte and Richmond in the 1990s when throngs of 15-to-20,000 were common. The women have averaged about 8,000 at their championship game.

The championships are under-performing on television, too. Ratings for the men’s and women’s finals on ESPN2 have been at 0.1 or 0.2 since 2003, and the estimated number of viewers for both genders has dropped since then, as well. That’s not entirely surprising given that the soccer matches compete with NFL games that at that time of the year typically determine playoff participants.

But supporters of a combined soccer championship believe the resulting “festival” atmosphere of a joint College Cup would shape college soccer’s two most high-profile games into one premier event that would energize the sport’s fan base and make for an attractive broadcast package that would drive ratings and interest.

Likewise, they say more strategically targeted resources could be devoted to marketing, fan engagement and student-athlete experience in a combined approach. Additionally, the NCAA would realize operational efficiencies in terms of signage and fan fest operations. ESPN would benefit, too, since the cable network would need only one production set rather than two as in past years.

As good as all of that sounds, it has taken time for the Division I soccer community to get used to the idea. Two surveys conducted by the National Soccer Coaches Association of America earlier this spring, in fact, still showed about 80 percent of respondents being against it.

The men’s and women’s soccer committees, whose composition includes several college coaches, also expressed concerns when broached with the idea of such a radical format change two years ago, but after talking it through decided the combined championships might be a strategic boost for the college game.

“It may prove to be in the best interests of our two championships and for the sport itself,” said Baylor Associate AD Paul Bradshaw, who chairs the women’s committee. “We kept coming back to this as an event – does the combined approach have the chance to elevate the two separate championships into one event?

“We felt it was worth taking a chance. It’s not like we are committing to this forever, but why not at least explore what we think is a reasonable option to grow our game? If this becomes the premier men’s and women’s soccer event in the United States that brings what now might be a fractured fan base together for one festival-type event, then why wouldn’t that be worth pursuing?”

Men’s committee chair John Diffley, a senior associate AD at St. John’s (New York), also pointed to the joint College Cups as a way to showcase the sport.

“The primary benefit of the combined approach is that it creates a festival atmosphere and brings more people to one location, which drives attendance and TV ratings for both championships,” he said. “That, in my mind, outweighs the concerns.”

Evaluating the concerns

Those concerns include field conditions, since the wear and tear on the championship field would be greater with two tournaments rather than one. Poor weather would exacerbate those concerns, though weather is an issue even with the separate championships, especially in mid-December.

But perhaps of greater concern to coaches and others are the devilish details of how such an event would be staged and what affect it would have on the regular season in both genders.

Rob Kehoe, the college programs director for the NSCAA, says most Division I coaches realize that changes are necessary to energize their most coveted events. While coaches want to be part of the solution, they’re uncertain about what that solution should be or what strategy the NCAA intends to employ to enhance the College Cups.

Among their concerns is how two sports previously on separate playing-season paths would interact on the same track. The identical date formulas could affect conference tournaments and NCAA preliminary-round games – especially for schools that typically advance both their men’s and women’s teams into the bracket (and who often host those early-round matches). They worry that the resulting logistics would place an undue burden on already taxed athletics staffs at host institutions.

Coaches also wonder whether a combined College Cup – as attractive as it might be – would diminish the identity or brand that each gender has worked to develop over time. Even if the events are held at the same site, the risk is that one gender’s event might be perceived as more “marquee” than the other. An NSCAA survey of players revealed a similar sentiment.

Others speculate that the fan base being targeted may not necessarily transfer from one gender’s championship to another, similar to other sports, such as men’s and women’s basketball.

That fan base may already be fractured, since many tickets at the College Cup go to registrants for the youth soccer showcase events for elite-level prospects held on the championship weekend. NCAA championship administrators have data showing that about 80 percent of the fans attending the College Cups are there for the youth tournaments. That manifests itself in smaller crowds for the college championship games after the youth teams and their followers have gone home.

While the College Cups likely will continue to embrace the youth tournaments – both because of their entertainment value plus the recruiting opportunities they present for college coaches – supporters of the combined approach say the college game nonetheless needs to be less reliant on the youth audience and cultivate its own crowd.

Kehoe said that’s a concern that needs to be addressed, since the youth ticket sales eat into the championship-sustaining community sales.

Unanswered questions

Perhaps most curious to the Division I coaching constituency, though, is how unprecedented a combined Division I championship would be for a team sport. Soccer would be the first, in fact, if the proposal passes.

Kehoe noted that just recently, the Division I Men’s and Women’s Swimming Committee decided to keep those championships separated by one week even though they are typically held at the same site. While swimming is an individual/team sport, that committee’s decision still resonated with the soccer coaches.

“The announcement of that decision also indicated that the opinions of the coaches were influential,” Kehoe said.

At the same time, other individual/team sports such as tennis and track have experienced success under the combined umbrella.

Whatever happens, Kehoe said, Division I soccer coaches, players and others want to improve the status of college soccer’s showcase events, particularly as they are compared to other Division I championships that are heralded as being successful, such as the Final Fours, the College World Series, the Frozen Four and the combined championships in men’s lacrosse.

“However, we also realize that we have some unique challenges, and many ‘uncontrollables’ such as weather, timing, and the selection of venues and communities that host the College Cups,” he said. “Soccer coaches do not want to give the impression that they have any interests other than to be part of the solution when it comes to elevating the men’s and women’s championships, but there are still a number of questions to answer.”

With the recent decision to delay the proposal to 2012, the committees are reviewing bids submitted for the 2011 finals and will determine sites for 2011 from that pool. Although those bids were based on the combined-championship format, the committees will award separate sites for the 2011 College Cups and retain the standard date formulas (first weekend in December for women; second for men).

If the proposal to proceed with the combined College Cups is approved, the committees will also use the current bid pool to select sites for the 2012 and 2013 championships, after which the combined approach will be re-evaluated.

I dont see how UP could host men's & women's playoff games on the same weekend, in the current pod system (not that we host as many games as we should...)

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by purple haze on Sat May 22, 2010 8:10 pm

The women's season ends late enough as it is. Neither Cary NC or College Station Texas, in mid-December sounds like a drawing card for the general soccer fan. New warmer-weather venues suitable for a joint men-women event would be a necessity. Will combining the women's fans and men's fans create a big synergy? Until soccer (for either gender) becomes a consistently well-attended sport for the regular season, the College Cup will remain a niche sports event -- a pilgrimage for hard-core fans of participating teams but not for the broad audience.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by UPSoccerFanatic on Sun May 23, 2010 11:55 am

How about if they keep the women on the same season start schedule and for the tournament quarter-finals play a home-away series? That would be great and might make the NCAA some money.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by onetouchfutbol on Sun May 23, 2010 2:46 pm

Hmmm... Well, wouldn't having the advantage of having lights and evening games help UP to work out the logistics? I personally kind of like the idea if we could swing it. It might be a way to get some more publicity for the sport and the involved colleges before the semifinals/Final 4 weekend.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by Geezaldinho on Sun May 23, 2010 4:55 pm

UPSoccerFanatic wrote:How about if they keep the women on the same season start schedule and for the tournament quarter-finals play a home-away series? That would be great and might make the NCAA some money.

How do you do tht without increasing the number of games? The NCAA has been very resistant to increasing games. Even with their biggest cash cow, basketball, they turned down potential Billions that could have been accrued fro growing the NCAA tournament. I don't think doubling the number of games stands a chance.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by harryb on Sun May 23, 2010 8:32 pm

It would increase the number of games for 8 teams in the nation. The QF is when it's important to get the right result. I kind of like the idea.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by DaTruRochin on Sun May 23, 2010 9:01 pm

yeah, but in a non-revenue sport how much fiscal sense would that make for the NCAA? (Haha, I think my mom knows Mark Emmert's mother in law, maybe I should try and grease those wheels a bit Razz) Only a handful of schools would even make it worthwhile in that regard, but in a perfect world the 2 leg system is the fairest of them all.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by Stonehouse on Mon May 24, 2010 11:44 am

I actually don't like the two-leg thing at all. I think it's ridiculously arbitrary that a goal on the road is worth more than a goal at home... yes, I realize soccer is a low-scoring sport, but I can't think of any other sport that gives basically what amounts to merit points for scoring on the road... could you imagine a two-game series in baseball, where they ended games at the 9th inning and the games were 2-2 and 1-1, and the road team in the first game moved on because they scored two on the road while the other team scored one? Or that happening in hockey or basketball or football? It just drives me up the wall when I think about it.

Two-game series, along with the out-of-control flopping/faking injury (even the greatest lovers of the game can't deny that this is one of the worst things about the sport and something that detrimentally damages its prospects for ever catching on in the USA), is one of the things I dislike the most about international soccer.

Anyway, back to the original post... I actually have no problem with merging the two. It would indeed save quite a bit of money, and I could definitely see it becoming more of an event if they had both going on at the same time. We do this for high school in Oregon and it's no problem at all. I think there is enough of a cross-over in fan support (I agree that fans of the women's game are different than fans of the men's game, but ultimately... soccer fans are soccer fans) for it to work, and actually... I could see it being more attractive for your average soccer fan (especially locals, wherever the tournament is held) to come out and see both finals as opposed to having to pick to see just one.

And really, I think if the NCAA is committed to doing it right, they should pick a permanent location. Yes, I realize this could potentially be an unfair advantage for some schools, but honestly... look how well it works for college baseball. But if you have it at the same place every year, it becomes a tradition in the local cummunity and well-supported there, and it gets rid of the mindless bidding process that happens year after year after year.

Seems like College Station makes the most sense - good chance for nice weather, existing strong support from the local community, good/large facility, a large school nearby that can help handle logistics...

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by UPSoccerFanatic on Mon May 24, 2010 12:32 pm

I can see arguments pro and con, on the basic question of combining the men and women.

However, I think College Station would be a poor location, at least if they have a boys and/or girls showcase event going on simultaneously. They simply don't have enough hotel accommodations. The article posted indicates that the NCAA is aware of problems with having a simultaneous showcase event, although the problem they seem to recognize has to do with ticket availability rather than hotel accommodations. It's not that I don't like College Station as a place to visit or don't like the field, I just don't think they can accommodate the attendance for the women only, much less the hoped for increased attendance from combining men and women. I think either Austin (Texas) or Dallas (SMU) would be better, with a preference for Austin since it's a great tourist destination.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by Stonehouse on Mon May 24, 2010 2:16 pm

Makes sense. I just assumed Big Football Town = Plenty of Hotel space.

Austin is great... does University of Texas have a good enough facility to host it?

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Have you ever been at a night game in College Station?????

Post by estplnr on Mon May 24, 2010 2:19 pm

I was in 2005 when we played Penn State and my daughter and I froze our butts off!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And our hotel......where 2 team were staying.....was a garbage pit!!!!! ED

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by UPSoccerFanatic on Mon May 24, 2010 5:51 pm

estplnr wrote:I was in 2005 when we played Penn State and my daughter and I froze our butts off!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And our hotel......where 2 team were staying.....was a garbage pit!!!!! ED

This is referring to College Station. That year, there was a real fiasco related to one of the host hotels for the teams, and I'm sure this is the one estplnr was referring to. It wasn't where the Pilots stayed, which was a very nice hotel outside of the downtown area.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by UPSoccerFanatic on Mon May 24, 2010 5:54 pm

Stonehouse wrote:Makes sense. I just assumed Big Football Town = Plenty of Hotel space.

Austin is great... does University of Texas have a good enough facility to host it?

The U of Texas facility is good, the one real drawback being that in their wisdom, whoever was responsible for the construction decided to put a track around the field. That being the case, fans are separated from the field by the track, which makes the atmosphere less intimate than at Merlo or at College Station.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by PurplePrideTrumpet on Mon May 24, 2010 10:30 pm

Stonehouse wrote:I actually don't like the two-leg thing at all. I think it's ridiculously arbitrary that a goal on the road is worth more than a goal at home... yes, I realize soccer is a low-scoring sport, but I can't think of any other sport that gives basically what amounts to merit points for scoring on the road... could you imagine a two-game series in baseball, where they ended games at the 9th inning and the games were 2-2 and 1-1, and the road team in the first game moved on because they scored two on the road while the other team scored one? Or that happening in hockey or basketball or football? It just drives me up the wall when I think about it.

Two-game series, along with the out-of-control flopping/faking injury (even the greatest lovers of the game can't deny that this is one of the worst things about the sport and something that detrimentally damages its prospects for ever catching on in the USA), is one of the things I dislike the most about international soccer.
A competition doesn't have to use away goals if the organizer doesn't want to. FIFA approves the away goals rule for determining a winner but does not require it. MLS doesn't use them, USL didn't last year, and they don't use away goals in the Football League playoff semifinals (there are playoffs for the last promotion places in the lower leagues in England). I actually don't really like it that much either.

If you take that out the two-leg series is fine with me. Each team plays at home and the team with the better record does get home-field advantage by hosting the second leg, so they get to have the extra time and penalties on their field.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by DaTruRochin on Tue May 25, 2010 1:20 pm

Well considering how the NCAA stance on travel rules (I think we MAY have gone over this topic once or twice before Rolling Eyes )... I'm gonna go ahead and say the 2 leg system just isn't going to happen. They are hesitant to have teams fly to a neutral site, haha all 64 teams having to travel back and forth to games, not exactly cheap. I mean unless they totally revamped it and made it more like a traditional soccer tournament with the round robin followed by the knock out stage (which would admittedly be kind of awesome...) I just don't see how it could ever work.

And well, i guess a road goal in international soccer is a bit different insomuch as being on the road is actually intimidating, just pure hate screamed at you, fans finding out where you sleep and terrorizing you and giving a true home advantage... Haha in that regard, perhaps that is the justification for giving the road goal merit (well that and to avoid shootouts, which are the worst thing ever invented... haha unless you like bunker defenses and the other things that come with watching Greek soccer)

But back to the point, I think making it a true celebration of soccer and having both tourney finales combined would be awesome. And as was mentioned it all depends on facility infrastructure and hotel rooms... Come to think of it, while we're tossing out names of places, why not the HDC?? I mean LA is kind of barfy, but it is the national soccer center.... And hotels wouldn't be a problem (although I guess renting out the stadium would cost $$$ obviously), but I think the soccer specific stadium is key if you want to make this a truly special event.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by PurplePrideTrumpet on Tue May 25, 2010 8:48 pm

Yeah, but with boring Greek soccer comes fantastic Greek supporters:


I love singing this, but the original Panathanaikos lyrics are even better (they're basically singing about how Pana is like a drug). Horto Magiko=Magical Weed, hehehe....

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by DaTruRochin on Wed May 26, 2010 12:00 pm

Haha, they have to be creative and fantastic, I mean, the game certainly isn't going to keep you awake....

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by UPSoccerFanatic on Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:53 pm

The NCAA also has a reorganization of the Women's Championship in the works. Here is what the Women's Soccer Committee is recommending. It will be a discussion item for the Division I Championships/Sports Management Cabinet at its June 15-16, 2010 meeting:

Tournament Format.

a. Recommendation. That the current 2-1-1-2 format of the Division I Women’s Soccer Championship be changed to a 1-1-2-2 format beginning in 2011.

b. Rationale. The current format currently provides for the first and second rounds to be contested at the same site with 16 sites hosting the weekend immediately after selections. From those 16 sites, the advancing institutions move to play a single match the following weekend in the third round at eight sites. The quarterfinals are then contested in the third weekend with a single match at four sites. The quarterfinal winners advance to the semifinals and championship at a predetermined finals site. The proposed format would provide for a single first round match contested at 32 sites. From there, the second round would also include a single match at 16 sites. Those institutions advancing to the next round would play at one of four campus-based, predetermined sites for the third and quarterfinal round on the same weekend. The four remaining institutions would advance to play in the semifinals and championship at a predetermined finals’ site.

The new 1-1-2-2 format contributes to the growth of NCAA soccer and enhances the student-athlete experience by allowing many more institutions to host the first round. Additionally, with more sites in the first round, the women’s soccer committee can help to mitigate travel challenges by keeping institutions more proximate to their home campuses in the first round.

Moreover, in allowing for four predetermined third/quarterfinal round sites, the women’s soccer committee can strategically place matches in areas of the country that are either targeted for growth of soccer or currently embrace soccer and would provide a meaningful experience for the student-athletes. NCAA staff will also work with the hosts to ensure operational excellence and marketing efforts are strategic and impactful. Additionally, this model allows for the addition of television in the future, as well as potentially corporate champion and partner activation.

c. Estimated Budget Impact. In order to control costs, it is recommended an administrative stipend of $3,000 be provided to hosts of the first round, as well as the second round. In order to reward those sites that market and promote the preliminary round, it is also recommended the revenue share be changed to a 70/30 split with 70 percent to the NCAA. It is currently 75/25 percent split with 75 percent to the NCAA. The proposed change would net as budget neutral to the overall Division I women’s soccer operating budget.
With having more hosting sites, it is believed revenues will also increase by allowing for more local crowds and fans.

In evaluating this model, a true comparison and analysis is not possible since the bracketing process was not conducted with this model as the guide.

d. Student-Athlete Impact. The proposed change in tournament format allows for unprecedented enhancements for the student-athletes competing in women’s soccer. By having only one match in the first round weekend, as well as only one match in the second round weekend, student-athletes have a greater opportunity to play in front of larger crowds, miss less class time, travel potentially shorter distances and obtain more rest after a long season and competitive conference tournaments.

e. Championships Group Comments. The proposed tournament format would provide a greater experience for not only the student-athletes, but the fans who supported the team throughout the year by rewarding more institutions with the opportunity to play at home. Moreover, the environment for the match has the potential to be more indicative of an NCAA championship in its presentation and excitement.

While some additional expenses in the form of signage, site representatives and equipment may exist, the incremental revenue from the greater attendance will offset the increase in expense.

The national committee and new coordinator of officials will have to work hard to ensure adequate and qualified staffing of NCAA site representatives and officials, however, the infrastructure, desire and plans are in place to ensure these needs are met.

The proposed format also addresses requests from the membership to eliminate the first and second rounds on the first weekend of the tournament, which allows for greater rest, potentially less travel and missed class time and could reduce the number of flights in the preliminary rounds.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by Harry Redknapp on Fri Jun 04, 2010 7:52 pm

Under this new format one would assume that UP would get to host the first two rounds, but then it's a crap shoot for the following weekend because that is at predetermined location.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by UPSoccerFanatic on Fri Jun 04, 2010 10:41 pm

"Moreover, in allowing for four predetermined third/quarterfinal round sites, the women’s soccer committee can strategically place matches in areas of the country that are either targeted for growth of soccer or currently embrace soccer and would provide a meaningful experience for the student-athletes. NCAA staff will also work with the hosts to ensure operational excellence and marketing efforts are strategic and impactful. Additionally, this model allows for the addition of television in the future, as well as potentially corporate champion and partner activation."

The above is from the Women's Soccer Committee's recommendation. They're saying that the criteria for setting the four third round/quarterfinal sites would be, if I read the statement correctly:

1. "Currently embrace soccer and would provide a meaningful experience for the student-athletes; or

2. "Are targeted for growth of soccer."

I'm wondering: What does "are targeted for growth of soccer" mean? This is an extremely vague criterion that easily could be used to justify having the games away from an area such as Portland.

On the other hand, the "currently embrace soccer" criterion would massively favor games at Portland and Texas A&M.

I'd love to know what the underlying in-house discussions have been. Perhaps, "We obviously should use Portland and College Station as venues, so where should be put the other two venues? Possibly at schools where we think there is the highest potential to match attendance and atmosphere at Portland and College Station? In other words, let's tell schools that if you want to host these games, you've got to match what Portland and TAMU are able to do." From a long-term, money-making perspective, this would make sense.

I can't decide whether I like or dislike these criteria.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by onetouchfutbol on Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:16 am

"I think it's ridiculously arbitrary that a goal on the road is worth more than a goal at home..."--Stonehouse.

Huh? Where are you pulling that idea from? I didn't read that in the press release.

DaTruRochin--I dont think that all 64 teams are going to need to be able to travel. This only includes the teams in the Final 4 on both the mens and womens side, correct? I think that's only 8 teams. In addition, aren't those 8 teams already travelling...except for the host of the Cup?

--------------------------------------------

Being a glass half full person, I still like the idea overall. Since sports are a ratings driven thing to a certain extent, it really sounds like this is a survival type of a thing to me. I like the idea of watching a soccer marathon for a weekend. I think the men's side of the sport deserves way more support than it gets during the cup weekend. I like the idea of the soccer community gathering together whether it's players, the media, WPS/MLS scouts, etc. If we want to continue to be able to watch our sport on tv, we might have to live with the pros and the cons of an arrangement like this.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by SoreKnees on Sat Jun 05, 2010 10:59 am

If I'm reading this correctly, the round of 16 and quarter-finals would likely be at neutral sites. I suppose that the pre-determined site would sometimes be at one of the qualifying schools, but it wouldn't necessarily be.

Given the nature of the seeding process, I think I'd favor any system that doesn't force us to play four years in a row against a #1 seed on their field in the quarterfinals!

Another advantage (if they keep the current scheduling) is that the two-game round of 16 and quarter finals would be on Thanksgiving weekend. If you have to try to make travel arrangements for teams that weekend, it might make sense for them to play twice. (Although 16 teams would have to travel vs. 4 now.)

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by Geezaldinho on Sat Jun 05, 2010 11:20 am

SoreKnees wrote:If I'm reading this correctly, the round of 16 and quarter-finals would likely be at neutral sites. I suppose that the pre-determined site would sometimes be at one of the qualifying schools, but it wouldn't necessarily be.

Given the nature of the seeding process, I think I'd favor any system that doesn't force us to play four years in a row against a #1 seed on their field in the quarterfinals!

Another advantage (if they keep the current scheduling) is that the two-game round of 16 and quarter finals would be on Thanksgiving weekend. If you have to try to make travel arrangements for teams that weekend, it might make sense for them to play twice. (Although 16 teams would have to travel vs. 4 now.)

Actually, the NCAA travel rules currently prohibit air travel between the Wednesday and Friday of thanksgiving weekend for all nonrevenue sports, not just soccer, and the soccer committees are powerless to alter that. The higher competiion committees would have to rule on that change.

So a two game weekend is probably not possible, regardless of what the soccer committees want.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by Geezaldinho on Sat Jun 05, 2010 11:30 am

You have to take some of the elements of the proposal with a grain of salt. Virtually every proposal I have ever seen talks about reducing lost class time, being revenue positive ( or at least revenue neutral) and there is already a rule in the bylaws that playoffs should favor teams that have a good attendance and revenue producing history.

In practice, these points are routinely ignored for other agendas, saving money on travel in non revenue sports being the main one.

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Re: Combined Men's & Women's College Cup in 2012?

Post by harryb on Mon Jun 07, 2010 4:00 pm

It seems like the two proposals discussed here (concurrent men's/women's and 1-1-2-2) are at odds schedule-wise. If the goal is to end up with the women on the same weekend as the men, wouldn't we have to do something like a 1-1-1-2?

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