Oregonians top 25

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Oregonians top 25

Post by A_Fan on Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:19 am

I see the Oregonian continues it tradition of overlooking UP soccer in today's listing of the top 25 most influential people in Oregon sports. Ken Bone is more influential than Bill Irwin or Garrett Smith? I was going to say unbelieveable, but unfortunately it's not. The myopia at the Oregonian Sports department is nothing new.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by FANatic on Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:06 pm

Bo Herzog's Top 25 would certainly have a UP rep or two. I would hope other sportswriters there would be aware enough to do the same. (I deviate: Maybe Abby Haight was better than Bo at covering the Pilots, as I believe some of you may feel. I liked Abby. But I think Bo did a real good job last season, from what I read. I've talked to Bo over the phone. Good Guy. Well informed.) Very Happy

Oh, here's the list: Top 25 2008 Most Influential Oregon Sports Figures

Canzano is in his own world. I do agree with many of his picks, and I like that he has been celebrating "you, the fans" recently. But you can't count on him to be on top of it half the time. (Yes, I agree he has written some great human interest story's. But when he goes off on a rant, he really embarrasses himself sometimes, IMO.) I've got "Baseball Jaynes" of the Trib in about the same catagory. He probably would have forgotten about UP also. Evil or Very Mad

Feel free to disagree with me. We need more action on this thread! Twisted Evil

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by PurplePrideTrumpet on Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:16 pm

Craig Robinson makes the list with a total of zero games coached at OSU? Ken Bone goes to the dance once and he suddenly makes the top 25? And "You" as #1? Of course the fans are influential year after year because they decide where to spend their money. I did like most of his choices, but it's a little heavy on the Blazer front office.

It's easy to see why the O ignores the Pilots. We only made another deep postseason run last year, and they probably have gotten used to that. And soccer really isn't talked about in the preseason or offseason the way fans follow the Blazers, or UO and OSU football.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by Geezaldinho on Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:58 pm

PurplePrideTrumpet wrote:Craig Robinson makes the list with a total of zero games coached at OSU? Ken Bone goes to the dance once and he suddenly makes the top 25? And "You" as #1? Of course the fans are influential year after year because they decide where to spend their money. I did like most of his choices, but it's a little heavy on the Blazer front office.

It's easy to see why the O ignores the Pilots. We only made another deep postseason run last year, and they probably have gotten used to that. And soccer really isn't talked about in the preseason or offseason the way fans follow the Blazers, or UO and OSU football.

You also have to consider where Canzano is in the sporting world. Sports to him is baseball, football and basketball. He's not very in tune with the rest of American culture as it is now evolving. Soccer is certainly nowhere on his list, and a Portland coach or player only make his list in Championship years.

In his world, Portland should have an NFL team, of even less likely and MLB team (imagine Portland trying to fill a stadium 80 times a year)
The reality is that it will take another irrational Billionaire to bring another major sport to Portland, and there just isn't one out there.

The only reason Paulson is on the list is because Canzano still holds out hope for baseball.

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Typical Oregonian

Post by pilotfan4ever on Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:24 pm

The Oregonian so much wants to be a big boy newspaper and because it doesn't respect what it has in the local market, is losing readership, and it doesn't give a damn about what it wants to become. I hate this newspaper, its liberal positions, and its ignorance of local sports, especially the Pilots.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by Geezaldinho on Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:29 pm

pilotfan4ever wrote:The Oregonian so much wants to be a big boy newspaper and because it doesn't respect what it has in the local market, is losing readership, and it doesn't give a damn about what it wants to become. I hate this newspaper, its liberal positions, and its ignorance of local sports, especially the Pilots.

Funny,

I dislike it because it is too conservative. It did, after all, endorse Gordon Smith and Genghis Khan.

well, maybe not the second one.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by SciFi on Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:48 pm

Purplegeezer wrote:
pilotfan4ever wrote:The Oregonian so much wants to be a big boy newspaper and because it doesn't respect what it has in the local market, is losing readership, and it doesn't give a damn about what it wants to become. I hate this newspaper, its liberal positions, and its ignorance of local sports, especially the Pilots.

Funny,

I dislike it because it is too conservative. It did, after all, endorse Gordon Smith and Genghis Khan.

well, maybe not the second one.

I think we can all agree that the Oregonian appears to be biased about a great many things; however, let's keep politics off this board.

The fact remains that University of Portland (and Portland State for that matter. . .) is largely snubbed by "PORTLAND's only daily newspaper." (Can I make it any clearer why this is such a travesty by the Oregonian ???) Not only that, but UP gets snubbed by many of Portland's other media outlets quite frequently as well. This is a problem. So the question is, what can WE the fans do to remedy this? What influence do we have?

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by KFTC on Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:07 pm

Okay, so I'll take up Canzano's side because I don't think he wrote this based on a popularity contest...what has any UP soccer/athletic department figure done in the last 12 months to be considered one of the most 25 influential people in Oregon Sports? The women's team lost in the quarters to UCLA and the men lost in the first round of their NCAA Tournaments. Canada didn't do much in the World Cup, so Sinclair and Sophie are out; Stephanie Lopez played in the World Cup for the US, but was outclassed by Marta (but honestly, who isn't outclassed by her?) in Brazil's 4-0 semi-final thumping of the US. Kasey Keller and other UP soccer alums in the international scene haven't done anything spectacular in the last year. Garrett Smith coaches the UP team but doesn't coach any of the Youth National Teams, so there's no youth world cup titles to contend for; and Bill coaches the U23 Women's Team, but they don't register any blips on the National radar even, so it's no surprise they aren't recognized in Oregon. Larry Williams hasn't done anything earth-shattering the last 12 months, as far as shaping the athletic department is concerned (remember, the logo redesign had already been done and dusted by this time last year); and until Eric Reveno has the men's basketball team competitive and signs some players that make a huge splash then he won't get on the list either.

Quite honestly, I can think of one person involved with Pilot athletics that might merit inclusion in this list, and that's Rob Conner of the Cross Country team. Dean Smith always said that UNC isn't as basketball school, it's a women's soccer school when they were reeling off their eleventeenth national championship in a row. I plead the same case now: Portland isn't a soccer school, it's a cross-country school...what he's done with the runners at Portland has been nothing short of phenomenal. With the US Track & Field trials in Eugene this year, you had to figure the guy responsible for getting them there and putting on a good show would get a mention, so Conner and Kilburg were out before they were even in.

But to put this back in the soccer thread, I don't think any UP soccer figures have done anything to merit a place on this list in the last 12 months. Craig Robinson may not have coached a game yet, but people are hyped up and paying attention to OSU basketball on a local and national level. Ken Bone is on there because PSU's tournament appearance got the city excited about college basketball in Portland, just the same as Jerry Glanville was on that list the summer before he'd coached a game at PSU because the city sports fans became somewhat excited about college football in Portland. I believe this list is about what is making sports exciting and interesting to follow in the city of Portland and the state of Oregon, and, with the exception of Kilburg's performance this year, UP has just maintained status quo in the last 12 months--nothing bad, but nothing great either; I mean, I would guess that Rob Chavez would've been on that list when UP made the NCAA Tournament in the 90s, as was Clive when UP won the first National Championship, and as was Garrett when they won their second. As for Canzano holding out hope for baseball? Well, he put MLS proponent and mayor-elect Sam Adams on the list, so I don't think he's as negative on soccer as some of you may think...I've read more soccer-positive columns from him than I ever have from Dwight Jaynes, and I think he put Paulson/Adams on that list because he knows a Portland MLS team would be hugely successful for raising national awareness of sports in Oregon...which, I believe is how he based his picks and rankings--who's raising, or has raised in the last year, national awareness of sports in Oregon?

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by Geezaldinho on Mon Jul 28, 2008 12:43 am

KFTC wrote:Okay, so I'll take up Canzano's side because I don't think he wrote this based on a popularity contest...what has any UP soccer/athletic department figure done in the last 12 months to be considered one of the most 25 influential people in Oregon Sports? T
......

....

I think he put Paulson/Adams on that list because he knows a Portland MLS team would be hugely successful for raising national awareness of sports in Oregon...which, I believe is how he based his picks and rankings--who's raising, or has raised in the last year, national awareness of sports in Oregon?

Well The title is the most influential people in Oregon in sports. How you performed isn't what it's about for the coaches or players. And influence is best measured by how you can use respect to go forward. How well some on that list measure up is debatable.

The three big fat cats I can see(Knight, Allen, Kilkenny), they do hold the purse strings.

All Paul Allen's execs except perhaps Prichard are sycophants who have no power of their own (how influential is Whittsit now, and how much power did he really turn out to have?) quick, no peeking, who were the others? Besides, Canzano WORKS for the Allen organization.

Lananna I can also see. getting the trials was a coupe. Galen Rupp I can also see. He's no Prefotaine, but he's the best we've got.

You discount the Pilots effort this year, but it beats the record of every team in the state last year, including all the football teams, and even Ken Bone's record. Only Ernie Kent did close, much to Kilkenny's dismay. Garrett did get a national coach of the year award - no one else did.

Jerry Glannville? Most influential 3-8 coach in history, maybe. Otherwise just fun to have around.

How can a Basketball coach be influential when he hasn't played a game yet? Sorry Obama's Brother-in-law isn't good enough.

In contrast, even though there were no titles last year, Bill and Garrett have kept Oregon in the minds of people Nationally when they think about soccer.

The Sam Adams - baseball thing is a pipe dream people, even if it did come about (not in my lifetime) Portland is like the 28th largest market. Take a look at how well teams in the 27th and 29th are doing. Besides, it's an election year, what's he supposed to say? he hates baseball and soccer? When he helps Paulson actually get an MLS team here, THEN he'll be influential.

Greg Oden - is he the next Bill Walton or the next Sam Bowie? only time will tell. So far, lotsa Hype, but not even one dunk yet.

The fact is, its a list of who Canzano wants to write about, usually because they are good interviews and make his life easier. It has almost nothing to do with the state of sports in the state. The "you the fans" choice is pure suck-up.


I do think the fish website lady was a great choice, I bookmarked it.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by A_Fan on Mon Jul 28, 2008 7:52 am

Well stated, Geezer, couldn't agree with you more.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by UPSoccerFanatic on Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:09 am

I see something else that's an issue: Except for Lannana (who I believe heads the women's program as well as the men's) and the athletic directors, there's no one having anything to do with a women's sports team. In other words, according to The Oregonian, women's sports are insignificant so far as athletics in Oregon are concerned.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by Stonehouse on Mon Jul 28, 2008 12:08 pm

Good conversation all around.

I think UPSF hit the nail on the head though. It's not so much UP getting slighted, it's that the basic landscape of sports in our country doesn't give much power (and that's what this is rating - power) to women's athletics.

The WNBA is the highest profile women's sport in the country, and that is only because it is propped up by the NBA.

Could Canzano have included somebody like Irwin or Garrett Smith and made a good argument for it? Absolutely. But I can understand why not. Because even if UP wins another national title, the exposure we would get from it would be about 1/1000 of what it would be if, say, Portland State upset somebody in March Madness.

But I think we all know what we have out at UP is special. And I think Abbey Height totally got that and capitalized on the magical 2005 season and proved that the city can and will get fully behind UP women's soccer. And it's proved that it wasn't just a one-year thing either... average attendance has increased every year since. No, we're not selling out playoff games in six minutes again, but ticket sales are still incredibly strong and ratings for the games on Comcast (especially the playoff games) were very strong. Heck, even the number of people who tune in to the UP audio broadcasts is very strong.

If Canzano doesn't think all that translates into being "powerful" in the Oregon sports scene, I totally understand and am not offended. But I don't think there's any way someone could disagree with the notion that UP has managed to build a wildly successful program that is the class of the country.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by Geezaldinho on Mon Jul 28, 2008 12:22 pm

I am just a little offended when no one associated with a great program (men and women, remember both teams made the tournament last year) isn't considered as influential as Darius Miles, who isn't even influential enough to have his own locker.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by PurplePrideTrumpet on Mon Jul 28, 2008 1:02 pm

I agree with you Geezer, but to Canzano and a lot of writers not on the Pilots beat, Clive was the face of the UP program. Canzano at most has an idea that Smith and Irwin were Clive's assistants. Abby Haigt, Bo Herzog, and Pilot fans all know better.

The problem is that while UP is known to soccer fans across the nation, there aren't that many soccer fans out there. I'm sure Garrett and Bill are well respected by the people who really know about these things, and I think that is more important for the Pilots than making a columnist's list of famous people he knows.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by A_Fan on Mon Jul 28, 2008 2:07 pm

It is important that Bill and Garrett are well respected by the people who really know about soccer. That doesn't put butts in the seats as the saying goes. The body of people in the seats grows when the organization gets positive publicity in the local press. This list is being discussed around watercoolers all over the state today and the Pilots are not part of that conversation. They deserve to be.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by Stonehouse on Mon Jul 28, 2008 2:44 pm

A_Fan wrote:This list is being discussed around watercoolers all over the state today and the Pilots are not part of that conversation. They deserve to be.

Well said. And I agree that they deserve to be. But I do understand why they aren't. It sucks, I know, but it's just kind of the way it is when you are talking about 1) soccer and 2) a women's sport.

But think about this too... Pat Casey, coming off two national championships in baseball, a higher profile sport than women's soccer, only checks in at #20.

And there isn't anyone from the high school or small college level. So there are lots of people that were snubbed.

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canzano's top 25

Post by upsailor on Mon Jul 28, 2008 3:40 pm

All I have to say on the subject, is consider the source !

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Great Topic - A_Fan

Post by FANatic on Mon Jul 28, 2008 6:55 pm

You started a great topic, A_Fan!!! Twisted Evil

This thread was about ready for the graveyard! Soon, we'll be talkin' young ladies playin' futbol. But that 'Top 25' really ignited people's emotions. Congrats to you all for a very entertaining discussion. cheers

There's nothing like a little controversy to stimulate the masses. And I really enjoy 'the masses' on Pilot Nation!!!

Note: Controversy sells papers. I'm sure many water-cooler folks today either ran out to buy the Sunday paper, or more likely in this futuristic world we live in, checked it out on OregonLive.com. (Clicks on the paper's web site make bucks, too. Don't they? - Also, "They Shoot Horses, Don't They?"). geek

-------> FANatic's sense of humor!!! <------- Love it, or leave it! scratch

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by SciFi on Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:14 pm

Sounds like the profile of the the Pilots soccer programs need to be raised further. The question is: How can this be achieved?

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by PilotNut on Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:57 am

It's funny, because I added a "comment" to the online listing yesterday, noting the absense of Clive Charles and/or Garret Smith. It looks like they have chosen to not post my comment since it still isnt there today.

Canzano really is a piece of work; heaven forbid anyone (on any topic, let alone this one) offer a differing opinion. Evil or Very Mad

(Oh, and he still hasnt come clean on the Mark Few to UO to replace Ernie Kent theory... oh but Ernie just got an extension...)


Last edited by PilotNut on Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:58 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Speling)

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by Geezaldinho on Tue Jul 29, 2008 10:51 am

PilotNut wrote:It's funny, because I added a "comment" to the online listing yesterday, noting the absense of Clive Charles and/or Garret Smith. It looks like they have chosen to not post my comment since it still isnt there today.

Canzano really is a piece of work; heaven forbid anyone (on any topic, let alone this one) offer a differing opinion. Evil or Very Mad

(Oh, and he still hasnt come clean on the Mark Few to UO to replace Ernie Kent theory... oh but Ernie just got an extension...)


Ha! Good luck getting past this:

Your comment has been received and held for approval by the blog owner.


John isn't known for his acceptance of dissenting views.

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Re: Oregonians top 25

Post by A_Fan on Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:43 pm

Thanks FANatic. I figured the topic would draw some attention from this crowd.

I sent Canzano an email about his article over the weekend. I kept my emotions in check and tried only to point out in a reasonable way how unreasonable it was to leave the Pilots unrepresented on his list. I didn't expect a reply and my expectations have been met so far.

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Well.... Well

Post by Geezaldinho on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:40 pm

PilotNut and I had our comments posted. Maybe you are next, Afan.


25 list

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